14 January, 2020 at 00:55 #64728
I’ve made some progress. I have v.5 running under BetaFlight 4.1.1, and have flown it on a small tricopter indoors (Kevin’s Whirlygig). It’s behaving nicely, although there is one change I want to make wrt to setting it up.
Getting v.5 running on iNav 2.3 isn’t quite there yet. The code builds and runs, but the tail servo won’t move. The servo icon in the configurator shows a response to yaw motion, and to different thrust factor settings, so triflight itself is running correctly. This may be specific to the KakuteF4V2TRI target, don’t know yet. BetaFlight and iNav have diverged (more than) enough that it’s actually a completely different integration. I will also make the same setup change to iNav I mentioned above once I get it working. I know my LR/KakuteF4V2 combo works, as I just tested it with dRonin to make sure, so it’s definitely something in the firmware. I may make a build for the Matek405 or KakuteF7HDV and see if I can get that combo to move the servo.
Getting close – there’s light at the end of the tunnel, and I don’t think it’s another train…..14 January, 2020 at 07:24 #64729
My LR flew great with triflight in dRonin, so I’m not convinced you really need the impossible tilt.
I might give it a try later.
Still waiting for better weather.14 January, 2020 at 14:45 #64732
@PeterPankras Well it’s a matter of degrees. I got mine flying well with the stock tail too on dRonin. But the impossible tilt provides a better mechanical setup. So that translates into less friction and inertia. Just comparing the two by hand (moving the tail) there is a huge difference between the impossible tilt with bearings (my version) and the stock tail (And I had my stock tail as free moving as possible I’ve built all of David’s tricopters). So if you reduce the force and time required to obtain a given tail position you improve response. My tri is flying much better on INAV with my new tail. In fact I couldn’t get a good tune in INAV without it.
If you get bored give it a try I think you’ll be impressed.14 January, 2020 at 15:12 #64733
@billyd I have an impossible tilt uploaded at shapeways in nylon ready for order. But that is a version without bearings I believe.
Do you have a link of your design somewhere?14 January, 2020 at 15:15 #64734
I’ll upload it to thingiverse tonight (not home can’t access the file from work). I’ve got several designs I need to upload and haven’t gotten around to it. I’ll message here when it’s up.15 January, 2020 at 00:00 #64736
@peterpankras I’ve uploaded to thingiverse. See impossible tilt thread in Tricopter LR forum here, for link to file.
Billy D.17 January, 2020 at 03:38 #64752yumemi5kParticipant
@jihlein nice to hear you are working on iNav 2.3 integration. I’m very interested in the dynamic rpm filter, as unlike in a 3″ where you can just throw everything above 200 Hz out and be happy, every Hz counts with a slower spinning rotor.18 January, 2020 at 20:14 #64758
Well here it is. It’s been quickly flown on a poorly tuned TriLR, but the tail did not oscillate wildly or drift randomly, and it completed an in air tail tune with reasonable numbers for both the thrustfactor and hover throttle. Some things to note:
1)Triflight is now implemented as a feature, and as such must be enabled or disabled as desired.
2)In the initial setup, the dynamic_yaw_hover_throttle is set to 0, and with this value, the dynamic yaw function is disabled. The dynamic yaw gains default to 1. When the in air tail tune is complete, this value will be populated with the value appropriate for the motor protocol you are using. It varies greatly from the older PWM protocols to the newer digital protocols, so there was no way to make a default other than 0, and use that value to disable dynamic yaw comp. Once populated, dynamic yaw still has no effect unless you’ve change the default gains values from 1. Remember the values are entered as scaled integers.
3)There’s a new term, tri_tail_motor_index. This tells the algorithm which channel is the tail motor. If you’re using the standard wiring convention, you can leave this at is default value, 0. If you’re motor wiring order is different you will need to change this to the 0 based value of your motor channel, and modify the mixer constants accordingly. Must users won’t mess with this, but I needed it for my builds, as I didn’t feel like re-wiring the fleet. My TriLR requires motors 1 and 3 to be swapped, so I set this to a value of 2 (zero based).
It was a short test flight in the backyard this morning, too cold and getting too windy to do much else. Only flew in the acro mode and in air tail tune, then quit. When initially setting up, start from a clean slate, reset your existing settings. With regard to the 0.7 version, some parameters have been deleted and some added, so the setting reset is the best way to make sure everything starts from where it belongs settings wise.
I’ve built two targets, KAKUTEF4V2TRI and KAKUTEF7HDV. Used both for bench testing, and the F4 for the flight testing.
Repo is at:
Hex files for the two targets I know work are attached.
There’s also a version for BetaFlight 4.1.1. Repo at:
Unified target builds attached, and the modified config files I used for testing are there too. For other targets, you’ll have to find the appropriate config file.
EDIT: file size restrictions won’t let me attach the compressed files as is, so I’ve trimmed them down to just the files necessary for the KakuteF4V2…….18 January, 2020 at 20:47 #64761
About point 3.
With standard wiring, do you mean how iNav expects the motors to be wired?
I’m not using the setup any more from Davids video the way we wired it in dRonin, but swapped motors 1 and 3 the way iNav shows in the setup (motor 1 being the tail motor)
So can I leave tri_tail_motor_index=0 ?
If weather permits I would like to do 1 last test with the previous 0.7 version firmware I have running.
Or else I will be flashing this version on the board and get it all setup for testing.
Thanx again!18 January, 2020 at 21:04 #64762
Yes, if you’re using the iNav recommended motor layout, you can leave the mixer alone and the tri_tail_motor_index at the default of zero, which means motor #1 is the tail motor.19 January, 2020 at 00:51 #64763
Thank you jihlein!19 January, 2020 at 03:28 #64764
Is the tail correct out of the box now? I didn’t have to reverse anything this time. Or am I about to crash lol?19 January, 2020 at 05:11 #64765
On my box stock TriLR, I did not have to reverse anything FWIW.19 January, 2020 at 20:59 #64770
Yes so something is already different about this hex since I had to reverse it with the .7 tri on inav and didn’t have to on this new .5 version.
Anyway as I’ve already reported changing my tail servo and going to the impossible tilt has made all the difference as far as an INAV tune. So maybe my tail servo was defective but still operational until it finally died. I am still working on that base tune before enabling triflight. But I’ve been able to use much higher gains without oscillation (on roll pitch and yaw) so it’s already miles better than anything I’ve had on INAV with the triLR to date. Flies good now. I could leave it the way it is but I think I can get it a little better so why not? So, super happy with that. I’ve got everything working well as far as nav settings go too. RTH pos hold etc. Want to tweak the pos hold a little as I am getting a little toilet bowl but I haven’t even begun to touch those settings anyway. Also got 22 sats just now in cloudy weather, that’s a personal record.
Too windy today to do tail tune so I will keep triflight disabled and continue to tweak inav pids. But this hex is already behaving much better in every respect so not sure why that is outside of my tail servo but why would that impact all the other issues? Must be more to it. Can’t thank jihlein enough! If you have a paypal donate setup please point me to it.21 January, 2020 at 20:05 #64789
I did a final short testflight with .7 today before I’m going to flash the .5 version on the FC.
Wanted to check some changes I did.
I can confirm that to get Angle mode to work you need to set
set max_angle_inclination_rll = 700
set max_angle_inclination_pit = 700
At least in my optinion. Or else you have no roll and pitch authority.
Don’t plan on using angle mode other than the initial tailtune flights.
GPS Position Hold and Altitude hold tested works very well.
I had triflight disabled for this flight, since I will continue testing that with .5
Still have to admit that it flies ok without triflight enabled.
Flashing .5 now, will report back when I can continue testing that 😉
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